--- Log opened Tue Feb 11 23:36:59 2003
23:37 -!- Topic for #iip-dev: IIP Meeting - logfiles: http://mids.student.utwente.nl/~mids/iip/
23:37 [Users #iip-dev]
23:37 [ ArdVark ] [ logger ] [ mids] [ ptm ] [ UserX]
23:37 [ jeremiah] [ lonelynerd] [ pox ] [ thecrypto]
23:37 -!- Irssi: #iip-dev: Total of 9 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 9 normal]
23:37 -!- Irssi: Join to #iip-dev was synced in 2 secs
23:57 < nop> hi hezekiah
23:58 < hezekiah> Hi. :)
23:58 -!- mode/#iip-dev [+o mids] by Trent
23:58 -!- mode/#iip-dev [+o nop] by Trent
23:58 <@mids> gimme an h. e. z. e. k. i. a. h
23:58 <@mids> hezekiah!
23:58 < hezekiah> lol
23:58 < lonelynerd> :D
23:58 < hezekiah> (Hmmm ....)
23:59 * hezekiah gets an idea wondering if I can do something in IRC.
23:59 <@nop> uh oh
23:59 -!- mode/#iip-dev [+o hezekiah] by Trent
23:59 -!- mode/#iip-dev [+o UserX] by hezekiah
23:59 < _42> what?
23:59 <@hezekiah> It works!
23:59 <@mids> kick me out?
23:59 <@hezekiah> Cool!
23:59 <@hezekiah> No.
23:59 -!- mode/#iip-dev [-o UserX] by mids
23:59 <@hezekiah> See if I could op UserX
23:59 <@nop> it worked yes
23:59 <@hezekiah> Oops.
23:59 <@mids> userx didnt identify
23:59 < _42> op everyone :)
23:59 <@hezekiah> Oh.
23:59 <@hezekiah> Sorry.
23:59 <@mids> he might be evil
23:59 <@mids> :)
23:59 <@hezekiah> My mistake. :(
23:59 <@mids> *grin&
23:59 <@hezekiah> I was just wondering if I could do it. (Good at C. Newborn at IRC.)
--- Day changed Wed Feb 12 2003
00:00 <@nop> anonymity and authentication take practice hezekiah
00:00 <@mids> Tue Feb 11 23:00:05 UTC 2003
00:00 < _42> Yeah, but we all know that nop is sa fe.
00:00 <@nop> you will learn grasshoper
00:00 <@nop> ok
00:00 <@nop> welcome
00:00 <@mids> Welcome to the 30th meeting
00:00 <@nop> _42 let's take this outside
00:00 <@nop> ;)
00:00 < thecrypto> yah!
00:00 < thecrypto> 30!
00:00 <@nop> sweet
00:00 <@nop> ok
00:01 <@nop> anyway
00:01 <@nop> welcome, do we have anything specific on the agenda
00:01 <@hezekiah> IIP 1.1 yet?
00:01 <@mids> nope!
00:01 < hobbs> 30 is the product of the first three primes. :)
00:02 <@nop> hehe
00:02 < thecrypto> yah!
00:02 < thecrypto> primes!
00:02 <@nop> simmer down everyone
00:02 <@mids> showstoppers for IIP 1.1:
00:02 <@mids> - file paths
00:02 < _42> what about them?
00:03 <@nop> 42 we have questions later
00:03 <@nop> after all this
00:03 <@nop> continue mids please
00:03 <@mids> 42 asked what is one with the file paths I guess
00:03 <@mids> I dont have other showstoppers
00:04 <@nop> oh
00:04 <@nop> well than do a .
00:04 <@nop> so we know
00:04 <@nop> sorry 42
00:04 < _42> it's ok
00:04 <@nop> ok umm, I believe UserX is working on the file path issue
00:04 <@nop> I don't think he's at his keyboard at this moment
00:04 <@mids> he didnt yet
00:04 <@mids> I checked today
00:04 <@nop> but I'll see if I can get that done stat
00:05 <@hezekiah> I also proposed a solution.
00:05 <@nop> oh ok
00:05 <@hezekiah> I'm willing to code it if someone tells me what to do.
00:05 <@mids> read http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=651711&group_id=50945&atid=461514
00:05 <@mids> and fix it :)
00:05 <@nop> ok, mids I think you know the details of what we wanted done, but did we decide on the proper paths?
00:05 <@hezekiah> If that
00:06 <@hezekiah> mids: ... that's the bugtracker ID, then I've already read it. :)
00:06 <@mids> yeah
00:06 <@mids> first ~/.iip/
00:06 <@mids> if not, current dir
00:06 <@hezekiah> Were we going to make an "install-local"?
00:07 <@mids> yes
00:07 <@hezekiah> BTW, accourding to my testing, the code already does that.
00:07 <@mids> I already made that I think...
00:07 <@hezekiah> It just requires that ~/.iip exists.
00:07 <@mids> hezekiah: it never ever puts iip.log in there
00:07 <@hezekiah> Ah.
00:07 <@hezekiah> That can be corrected. :)
00:07 <@mids> and maybe also not mynode.ref
00:07 <@hezekiah> Any other files that need to be there?
00:07 <@hezekiah> (I think it does put node.ref there.)
00:08 <@mids> userx' problem was that the logger code is very low level
00:08 <@hezekiah> How's that affect the file paths?
00:08 <@mids> and it doesnt have the extended features like '@' extends to path
00:09 <@hezekiah> (I wish people would tell me they want these things.) I can probably write that up for him.
00:09 <@hezekiah> In the development tree that is. I'm not sure what the logging code in head looks like.
00:10 <@hezekiah> I should be able to write that up for him in head as well.
00:10 <@hezekiah> I'll have to ask him exactly what he wants. :)
00:11 <@mids> do that
00:11 <@hezekiah> OK. :)
00:11 <@hezekiah> So exactly what files _aren't_ getting placed in ~/.iip?
00:12 <@hezekiah> You mentioned iip.log.
00:12 <@mids> according to codeshark: iip.log, isproxy.ini, mynode.ref, seed.rnd
00:12 <@hezekiah> Hmmm.
00:12 <@hezekiah> I can't remember which CVS tree I tested, but isproxy.ini, node.ref, and seed.rnd were are placed in ~/.iip.
00:13 <@hezekiah> The key was that ~/.iip needs to exist _and_ isproxy.ini needs to be in ~/.iip or not exist.
00:13 <@hezekiah> When those conditions are met, the 3 files I listed are placed in ~/.iip.
00:13 <@mids> if not, current directory
00:14 <@hezekiah> Right.
00:14 <@hezekiah> isproxy.ini listen.ref node.ref seed.rnd
00:14 <@hezekiah> Those are the files that the development branch places in ~/.iip.
00:14 <@mids> what about mynode.ref ?
00:15 <@hezekiah> mids, I've never met a file called mynode.ref.
00:15 <@hezekiah> What is it?
00:15 <@mids> it is created if you make a public/private relay
00:15 <@mids> contains the info that is also sent to inform
00:15 <@nop> yes
00:16 <@nop> it's designed for if you want to do neighbor noding
00:16 <@hezekiah> It is only mentioned in active sourcecode at: iip/iip-ui.c:650
00:16 <@nop> they specifically piggy back off you
00:16 <@nop> so they can bootstrap
00:16 <@nop> into the network
00:18 <@mids> ok
00:18 <@mids> keep in mind that the filepath can be changed
00:18 <@mids> it has to work if the filepath is changed too
00:18 <@hezekiah> (I'm looking into where mynode.ref gets placed.)
00:18 <@mids> or if the location for the individual files are specified too
00:18 <@hezekiah> mids: right now the filepath is hardcoded into the code.
00:19 <@mids> -f lets you change the path
00:19 <@hezekiah> If features are added in the future to do those things, then the code can be adapted to work with them.
00:19 <@mids> see my manpage :)
00:19 <@hezekiah> Hmmm ... odd.
00:20 <@hezekiah> Oh, duh! Right, the part that's hardcoded is used as a default parameter.
00:21 <@mids> thats fine
00:21 <@hezekiah> Anyway, I'll talk to UserX and see what he has done/wants done. :)
00:21 <@nop> coo
00:21 <@mids> huya
00:21 <@hezekiah> huya?
00:21 <@mids> lets try to get this done BEFORE the next meeting
00:22 <@hezekiah> If I can catch UserX before the next meeting (which I should), and I can get rid of this cold (which I should), and I don't make any more braindead mistakes (which I hope I won't), then hopefully, it will be.
00:22 <@hezekiah> (Note I garuntee nothing: Coding is far to volatile [no pun intended] to do that.)
00:23 <@mids> would be awesome
00:23 <@mids> okay
00:23 <@mids> other release issues?
00:23 <@mids> did everybody look at the new manpage?
00:23 <@mids> can the old one be removed?
00:23 <@hezekiah> Yeah.
00:23 <@hezekiah> Do you want it removed?
00:24 <@mids> I'll do that right away
00:24 <@mids> I wont put the .1 manpage in CVS
00:24 <@mids> if we release, it has to be created
00:25 <@mids> I'll send my Makefile with install-local to the mailinglist
00:25 <@hezekiah> Should the makefiles create the manpage?
00:25 <@mids> not right now
00:26 <@mids> end-users dont need to have perl
00:26 <@hezekiah> OK. Should they be installed by the Makefile?
00:26 <@mids> (which ships perldoc)
00:26 <@mids> future versions can have a make distribute or something
00:27 <@hezekiah> I'm asking these questions because right now the automake Makefiles for the development tree install the isproxy.1 manpage.
00:27 <@mids> making a directive that makes an isproxy.1 out of isproxy.pod should be simple
00:28 < lonelynerd> [
00:28 <@hezekiah> Right. But that makes the end user require perl. :)
00:28 < lonelynerd> whoops
00:28 <@mids> pod2man -s 1 -c isproxy -r $VERSION ./$NAME/doc/isproxy.pod >./$NAME/doc/isproxy.1
00:28 <@hezekiah> Remember, you said you don't want them to need perl.
00:28 <@mids> then put that in the make distribute code
00:28 <@mids> I am more talking about requirements for 1.1
00:28 <@mids> 1.2 is different
00:29 <@mids> k
00:30 <@mids> TODO: mids mail install-local makefile
00:30 <@mids> hezekiah contact userx
00:30 <@hezekiah> Right.
00:30 <@mids> nop: look at podfile
00:30 <@mids> okay, for install-local
00:30 <@mids> where should the binary and manpage be installed?
00:30 <@mids> ~/bin and ~/man or something?
00:31 <@mids> or not install manpage..
00:31 <@hezekiah> What did UserX say in our email conversation?
00:31 <@nop> ok
00:31 <@hezekiah> Oops.
00:32 <@hezekiah> nop?
00:32 <@nop> yes
00:32 <@nop> which email conversation
00:32 <@hezekiah> You were saying something. :)
00:32 <@nop> no
00:33 <@nop> just saying I'd look at podfile
00:33 <@hezekiah> Oh, mids, UserX, and I were going back and forth about what to do with the file path problem.
00:33 <@hezekiah> Part of that involved making an install-local makefile target.
00:33 <@hezekiah> I think I sent CC's of all my messages to you.
00:33 <@mids> did get some
00:33 <@hezekiah> Except for one that your email box wouldn't accept because it was full.
00:33 <@hezekiah> (I anonymailed you the summary of that one.)
00:34 <@hezekiah> I quote from UserX: "A possible solution to this is to add a "install-local" target to the Makefile. This would put the executable in ~/bin/ and other files in ~/.iip/."
00:35 <@mids> mail sent
00:37 <@hezekiah> So for now, install-local only copies node.ref and isproxy.
00:37 <@hezekiah> I still see a small problem.
00:37 <@hezekiah> When the user just runs "make install".
00:38 <@hezekiah> ... then ~/.iip doesn't get created.
00:38 <@hezekiah> Thus, isproxy will still leave its files in the current directory.
00:38 <@mids> can you check userid with make?
00:38 <@hezekiah> Huh?
00:38 <@mids> so if you arent root, make install will give an error
00:39 <@hezekiah> You can run a command like whoami.
00:39 <@mids> would that be an option?
00:39 <@hezekiah> id -u
00:39 <@hezekiah> That should spit out the numeric ID of the user.
00:40 <@mids> "Error: make install requires you to be root, use make install-local instead"
00:40 <@hezekiah> Well, they should get that anyway if they are trying to copy files to /usr/local/bin
00:41 <@hezekiah> It still doesn't fix the problem: isproxy will not place files in ~/.iip unless it exists, and "make install" doesn't create it.
00:41 < nemesis> can i speak?
00:41 <@hezekiah> (I don't see why not. Nop or mids can he speak?
00:41 <@hezekiah> )
00:41 < nemesis> ;)
00:41 <@mids> please speak
00:42 < nemesis> anyone know the linux distri SoL (server optimized linux) ? there are a root /server for all servers, unreal are added too
00:42 <@mids> (hezekiah: make install makes /home/iip/.iip/ and installs there)
00:42 < nemesis> it would be nice when iip goes someday in that distri
00:43 < _42> What about configure --prefix=~ ?
00:43 < nemesis> any suggestions?
00:43 <@mids> _42: 1.1 doesnt have configure yet, 1.2 does
00:43 < _42> oh.
00:43 <@hezekiah> _42: the main branch of CVS doesn't have a configure script.
00:43 <@mids> _42: good point though
00:43 <@hezekiah> _42: but I already suggested that for 1.2. :)
00:44 <@mids> nemesis: once 1.1 is out, we'll ask distributetions to make packages
00:44 <@mids> which leads us to the following, we need an init.d script
00:44 <@mids> we should really supply that
00:44 < nemesis> SoL usese XML for that
00:44 < nemesis> very nice configs...
00:44 < _42> mids: they're distro-defined. I might be able to write a gentoo one.
00:45 <@hezekiah> And Gentoo uses a different format than most.
00:45 <@mids> iip.1.1.showstoppers.add(init.d-script)
00:45 <@mids> maybe we can supply a general one?
00:45 <@hezekiah> I wouldn't bet on it working.
00:45 <@mids> ah
00:45 <@mids> so, we dont have to?
00:45 <@hezekiah> I'd save leave it to the distros, or make distro-specific ones.
00:45 < _42> mids: gentoo uses a dependency system with its init.d scripts. It's simple, but incompatible.
00:45 <@mids> k
00:45 <@mids> then lets leave it
00:46 <@mids> I still have some contact info of a debian packages
00:46 <@hezekiah> _Especially_ when not all distros even USE init.d! (Gentoo uses a totally different format.)
00:46 <@hezekiah> OK. :)
00:46 <@mids> he offered to package iip in the past
00:46 <@hezekiah> Cool! :) So where were we?
00:46 <@mids> show stoppers
00:46 <@mids> any more?
00:46 <@hezekiah> Oh, yeah.
00:46 <@hezekiah> I don't know of any
00:46 < nemesis> when will 1.1 be released? ;)
00:46 <@mids> nemesis: once all the show stoppers are tackled
00:47 <@hezekiah> When we fix all the showstoppers! ;-)
00:47 <@mids> what about the windows helpfile thing
00:47 <@mids> how does that work atm?
00:47 < nemesis> *g* k thx
00:47 <@mids> what does it say
00:47 < _42> mids: If I knew the proper start/stop commands I could write a gentoo runscript.
00:47 <@hezekiah> I have no clue. I don't use Windoze unless I need to.
00:47 <@mids> I believe that codeshark made a 'no help right now, see http://help.invisiblenet.net/' or something
00:47 <@hezekiah> (If it comes to that, I could write one, _42. I use Gentoo.)
00:47 <@mids> thx
00:48 < _42> hezekiah: how about one of us does the ebuild, and the other the init.d? :)
00:48 <@hezekiah> Fine. I don't really care. :)
00:48 < _42> yes, but who does what?
00:48 <@mids> ok
00:48 <@mids> any windows user?
00:48 <@hezekiah> You can do both if mids lets you. :)
00:49 <@mids> it wont be bundled in the 1.1 release itself
00:49 * hezekiah listens to the thunderous silence resounding through the room.
00:49 <@mids> oh yeah
00:49 <@hezekiah> What?
00:49 <@mids> nop had to read through the docs
00:49 <@mids> some crypto things changed
00:50 < _42> what, the ebuild? of course not. That's distributed from Gentoo HQ. in a mysteriopus complex in (DELETED FOR DISTRO SECURITY REASONS) via rsync
00:50 <@hezekiah> So what's the list of stuff we need to do until 1.1 look like now?
00:50 <@hezekiah> _42: I know. But you can write one and submit it to the bugzilla list.
00:50 <@mids> - filepath
00:50 <@mids> - install-local
00:50 <@mids> - readme, install, authors update
00:51 <@mids> - windows documentation check
00:51 <@mids> .
00:51 <@hezekiah> - and nop needed to look at those docs you mentioned?
00:51 <@nop> ok
00:51 <@hezekiah> Or was that the windoze doc check?
00:52 <@mids> well
00:52 <@mids> the docs on http:L
00:52 <@hezekiah> Ah! :)
00:52 <@mids> http://help.invisiblenet.net/ can be changed also after release
00:52 <@hezekiah> So my work is talking to UserX about the filepath stuff and seeing how I can help all this.
00:52 <@mids> yes
00:52 <@mids> and pushing us to do our stuff
00:52 <@hezekiah> lol.
00:53 <@hezekiah> I wouldn't do good at that. You're better at pushing. ;-)
00:53 <@mids> I k
00:53 <@mids> I'll request daily updates
00:53 <@mids> at 8.00 am
00:53 <@mids> :)
00:53 <@hezekiah> Do I change the development automake Makefile templates to mimic your install-local, or does it need to be reviewed first?
00:54 <@mids> it is a request for comments
00:54 <@hezekiah> Ah.
00:54 <@mids> lets first put it in 1.1, if everybody agrees
00:54 <@mids> cvs dev can be done later
00:54 <@hezekiah> I have a comment: let's make a PREFIX var.
00:54 <@hezekiah> Right now /usr/local is hardcoded into several variables.
00:55 <@mids> in Makefile?
00:55 <@hezekiah> This is a pain for anyone that needs to install on a system that doesn't use /usr/local.
00:55 <@hezekiah> Yeah.
00:55 <@mids> ok
00:55 <@hezekiah> i.e. INSTALLEXEPATH would look like this
00:55 <@hezekiah> > PREFIX=/usr/local
00:55 < _42> what's the syntax for checking out the 1.1 branch?
00:55 < _42> from cvs
00:55 <@mids> 1.1 is HEAD
00:55 <@hezekiah> > INSTALLEXEPATH=$(INSTALLEXEPATH)/bin
00:55 <@hezekiah> .
00:55 < _42> ok
00:56 <@hezekiah> 1.2 is development. :)
00:56 <@hezekiah> ;-)
00:56 < _42> oh, how zen
00:56 < _42> You must be one with the development...
00:56 <@hezekiah> Anyway, a PREFIX var would let someone go "make PREFIX=/usr install" instead of setting 3-4 other variables.
00:57 <@hezekiah> _42: yeah. :)
00:57 <@hezekiah> _42: but I do bugfix stuff for 1.1 too ... it's just that most my code goes in development.
00:57 <@mids> how do you let make PREFIX= override the PREFIX in the Makefile?
00:57 <@hezekiah> "make PREFIX=/usr install"
00:57 < _42> 'k. But if dev is in CVS, wouldn't a co without a -r get it as well?
00:57 <@mids> I mean, in the makefile itself
00:58 <@hezekiah> It would override whatever PREFIX was set to in the makefile.
00:58 <@mids> automagically?
00:58 <@hezekiah> If PREFIX=/usr/local in the makefile "make PREFIX=/usr install" makes PREFIX=/usr instead.
00:58 <@mids> great
00:58 <@hezekiah> That's one way how Gentoo ebuild get around anoying makefiles. :)
00:58 <@mids> ok
00:59 <@mids> nother thing
00:59 <@hezekiah> Cool.
00:59 <@mids> in iip/doc/help/imaghes
00:59 <@mids> iomages
00:59 <@mids> images even :)
00:59 <@mids> there are some bmp files
00:59 <@mids> I believe that they can be removed
00:59 <@mids> iip.pdf in doc/help too
00:59 <@hezekiah> You sure the files in doc/help don't use them?
00:59 <@mids> no idea
00:59 <@mids> I am not a windows guy
00:59 <@hezekiah> (Ouch.)
01:00 <@mids> should ask codeshark
01:00 <@mids> he made em
01:00 <@hezekiah> Neither here, but I try to be careful.
01:00 <@hezekiah> I'll leave the removing of files from the HEAD branch to you. :)
01:00 <@hezekiah> (... and keep my neck safely on my shoulders.) ;-)
01:00 <@mids> ok, I removed isproxy.1 from both branches
01:00 <@hezekiah> Ah.
01:00 <@mids> super todo: mail todo list to mailinglist
01:00 <@mids> :)
01:00 <@hezekiah> lol
01:01 <@hezekiah> First we should update it.
01:01 <@hezekiah> There are a bunch of things I've done that never got checked off.
01:01 <@hezekiah> Also, the development branch makefiles depended on isproxy.1.
01:01 <@mids> oh
01:01 <@mids> I already removed isproxy.1 from dev
01:02 < _42> The Makefile should support copying files to one dir but configuring the executable for another
01:02 <@hezekiah> So what do I do _exactly_ with isproxy.pod?
01:02 <@mids> here it comes:
01:02 < hobbs> mmm. pod.
01:02 <@hezekiah> Well, we can put it back if we need to, but I think there are better things to do. :)
01:02 <@mids> hezekiah: pod2man -s 1 -c isproxy -r $VERSION ./$NAME/doc/isproxy.pod >./$NAME/doc/isproxy.1
01:02 <@hezekiah> _42: it does. The executable and makefiles go in different places. They were both targets for "make install" though.
01:03 <@mids> I hope that the makefile knows the version somehow
01:03 <@hezekiah> I can handle that.
01:03 <@hezekiah> But this makes the user require perl.
01:03 <@nop> sorry guys I'm in and out
01:03 <@nop> at work so
01:03 <@hezekiah> (We were over this before.)
01:03 < _42> No, I mean copy the files to one directory specified by overriding a makefile var and configure them for another
01:03 <@hezekiah> No problem. :)
01:03 <@mids> you can replace "./$NAME/doc/isproxy.pod >./$NAME/doc/isproxy.1" with "$? > $@"
01:03 < _42> k
01:04 <@hezekiah> OK.
01:04 <@hezekiah> But this still leaves the user of the development branch dependant on perl.
01:04 <@hezekiah> Is that OK?
01:04 <@mids> depend on pod2man
01:04 <@hezekiah> OK.
01:04 <@hezekiah> So I make the configure script look for it.
01:04 <@mids> yes
01:05 <@mids> _42: doesnt gentoo patch makefiles etc?
01:05 <@mids> (like freenet does)
01:05 <@hezekiah> nop: any objections to me having the configure script look for pod2man and having the makefile (in the development tree) build the manpage?
01:05 <@hezekiah> mids: Gentoo uses patches, sed, or just sets makefile VAR's.
01:06 <@hezekiah> mids: whichever least drastic measure is required. :)
01:06 * mids guesses that nop doesnt object
01:06 < _42> mids: it can, but it's easier to add a PREFIX=${D}/
01:06 <@mids> _42: yop
01:06 < _42> freenet patches akefiles?
01:06 <@mids> freebsd
01:06 < _42> ah
01:07 <@mids> or maybe it doesnt
01:07 <@mids> anyway
01:08 <@mids> - filepath (A hezekiah, userx)
01:08 <@mids> - Makefile install-local,PREFIX
01:08 <@mids> - README, INSTALL, AUTHORS (mids)
01:08 <@mids> - windows documentation (codeshark)
01:08 <@mids> - docs (nop)
01:08 <@mids> any additions?
01:09 <@mids> otherwise I'll mail that
01:09 <@hezekiah> Not that I can think of. :)
01:10 <@mids> who will do the makefile?
01:10 <@mids> me?
01:10 <@hezekiah> You do the HEAD one.
01:10 <@mids> I am talking about HEAD
01:11 <@hezekiah> I usually take care of the makefiles/configure script in development. :)
01:11 <@hezekiah> You do it. :)
01:12 < lonelynerd> what about debian packages? ;)
01:12 <@mids> lonelynerd: that can be done after the code is frozen / release is made
01:12 < lonelynerd> sure
01:13 <@mids> TODO mailed
01:13 <@mids> ok
01:13 <@mids> question round?
01:14 <@mids> question round.
01:14 < hezekiah> Sorry about that.
01:14 < hezekiah> I got disconnected.
01:14 <@mids> you did? :)
01:14 < hezekiah> Yeah. :)
01:16 <@mids> okay, meeting participants without questions are not allowed to ask any for a week if they could ask them now :)
01:16 < hezekiah> lol.
01:16 < hezekiah> mids: do people actually come up to you with questions during the week?
01:17 <@mids> shiploads
01:17 < hezekiah> Wow!
01:17 < lonelynerd> ;)
01:17 <@mids> mostly in #iip and #help
01:17 < hezekiah> Oh. "Mommy, Mommy! What's an isproxy!?"
01:17 < hezekiah> ;-)
01:17 <@mids> RTFM
01:18 < hezekiah> lol
01:18 <@mids> ok
01:18 <@mids> end?
01:18 * hezekiah hands mids his gaffle to "baf"
01:18 <@mids> baf it will be
--- Log closed Wed Feb 12 01:19:02 2003