447 lines
26 KiB
HTML
447 lines
26 KiB
HTML
{% extends "_layout.html" %}
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{% block title %}I2P Development Meeting 31{% endblock %}
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{% block content %}
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<h3>I2P (invisiblenet) Development Meeting 31</h3>
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<div class="irclog">
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Courtesy of <a href="http://www.archive.org/">the wayback machine</a>.
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<p>
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<p>--- Log opened Tue Feb 18 23:54:43 2003
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<p>23:54 -!- Topic for #iip-dev: IIP Meeting - logfiles: http://mids.student.utwente.nl/~mids/iip/
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<p>23:54 [Users #iip-dev]
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<p>23:54 [ aum ] [ bpb ] [ jeremiah ] [ logger]
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<p>23:54 [ Barney] [ codeshark] [ LeerokOnKnoppix] [ mids ]
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<p>23:54 -!- Irssi: #iip-dev: Total of 8 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 8 normal]
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<p>23:54 -!- Irssi: Join to #iip-dev was synced in 2 secs
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<p>23:55 * bpb points at the logging bot then jumps up and down like a japanese animated school girl
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<p>23:55 -!- mode/#iip-dev [+o mids] by Trent
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<p>23:55 -!- mode/#iip-dev [+v logger] by mids
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<p>23:57 -!- LeerokOnKnoppix is now known as Trent
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<p>23:57 -!- Trent is now known as nickthief76011
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<p>23:57 <@mids> :p
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<p>23:57 -!- nickthief76011 is now known as LeerokOnKnoppix
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<p>23:57 < lonelynerd> wwwhat?
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<p>23:58 <@mids> Trent protects the nick
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<p>23:58 < lonelynerd> oh, nothing
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<p>23:58 < LeerokOnKnoppix> How does it do that?
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<p>23:58 -!- LeerokOnKnoppix is now known as _Trent
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<p>23:58 < _Trent> I am Trent, hear me roar!
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<p>23:58 < hezekiah> LOL
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<p>23:58 < _Trent> Get out, all unverified users!
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<p>23:59 -!- mode/#iip-dev [+o hezekiah] by Trent
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<p>23:59 < _Trent> What about me?
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<p>23:59 <@mids> hey hezekiah :)
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<p>23:59 -!- _Trent is now known as LeerokOnKnoppix
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<p>23:59 <@hezekiah> Hi, mids. :)
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<p>23:59 <@hezekiah> I think I'm getting the hang of some of this IRC thing! :)
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<p>23:59 <@mids> kool
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<p>--- Day changed Wed Feb 19 2003
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<p>00:00 <@hezekiah> So have any bugs defied the great IIP dev team and risen their ugly heads since your last mail to the iip-dev mailinglist?
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<p>00:01 < LeerokOnKnoppix> It disconnects every now and then.
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<p>00:01 <@hezekiah> I don't seem to experiance that bug. :(
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<p>00:01 < lonelynerd> LeerokOnKnoppix, it's probably your connection. i haven't had any problems
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<p>00:01 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Hmm.
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<p>00:01 <@hezekiah> mids: Where are nop and UserX?
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<p>00:01 <@mids> Tue Feb 18 23:01:51 UTC 2003
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<p>00:01 <@mids> user was here but he pinged out
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<p>00:01 < LeerokOnKnoppix> _Trent kicked them out.
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<p>00:02 <@mids> userx
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<p>00:02 <@mids> just icq-ed nop
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<p>00:02 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Is he coming?
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<p>00:02 <@mids> dunno
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<p>00:02 < bpb> lonelynerd: it's always happened though... and it's not just him
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<p>00:03 < lonelynerd> bpb, still, it's not a problem with iip but unreliable connections
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<p>00:04 <@mids> nop is comming
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<p>00:04 < nop> hi
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<p>00:04 < lonelynerd> hi
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<p>00:04 < nop> ok
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<p>00:04 < nop> welcome
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<p>00:04 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Hello nop.
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<p>00:04 <@hezekiah> Hi, nop! :)
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<p>00:04 < nop> Leerok likes Knoppix?
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<p>00:04 < LeerokOnKnoppix> So far.
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<p>00:04 < nop> kewl
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<p>00:04 < nop> ok
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<p>00:04 < bpb> lonelynerd: it's a problem with the actual network then
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<p>00:04 < LeerokOnKnoppix> But I want to install it to the hard drive.
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<p>00:04 < LeerokOnKnoppix> But it didn't work when I tried it.
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<p>00:04 < nop> well, welcome to the 31st meeting
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<p>00:04 < nop> of IIP-dev
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<p>00:04 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Cool.
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<p>00:04 < lonelynerd> bpb, well, it could handle unrealiable links, but it doesn't at the moment
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<p>00:04 < LeerokOnKnoppix> I'm just hanging around to let knowledge osmose into my head.
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<p>00:05 < nop> ok
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<p>00:05 < nop> shh
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<p>00:05 < nop> meeting started
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<p>00:05 < nop> on the agenda
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<p>00:05 -!- mode/#iip-dev [+o nop] by mids
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<p>00:05 <@nop> IIP 1.1 and pleasantries with that
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<p>00:05 <@nop> hezekiah:
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<p>00:06 <@hezekiah> Yeah?
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<p>00:06 <@nop> hezekiah: all entropy stuff have we resolved? For instance the hhhhhh issue
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<p>00:06 <@hezekiah> I just told you about the hhhhhhhh isue.
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<p>00:06 <@hezekiah> We haven't done anything about it yet.
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<p>00:06 <@nop> ok
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<p>00:06 <@hezekiah> The seed.rnd issue is resolved by porting the --randomdialog option from development ..
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<p>00:06 <@nop> ok
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<p>00:07 <@nop> and can you explain what they do
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<p>00:07 <@nop> just for the record
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<p>00:07 <@hezekiah> ... and having IIP abort when seed.rnd doesn't exist.
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<p>00:07 <@hezekiah> Explain what --randomdialog and --ignoreemptyrandom do?
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<p>00:07 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:07 <@hezekiah> OK. :)
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<p>00:07 <@nop> for official purposes
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<p>00:07 <@nop> aka the meeting
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<p>00:07 <@hezekiah> Right. :)
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<p>00:08 <@hezekiah> When isproxy is run with --randomdialog, the user is asked for entropy (even is seed.rnd already exists).
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<p>00:09 <@hezekiah> When isproxy is run with --ignoreemptyrandom, and there isn't enough entropy (a condition that would cause isproxy to _normally_ abort), the program just keeps going. This is a security risk, so a suitablely scary warning label is added in the help description.
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<p>00:09 <@hezekiah> (Speaking of all these options, unless mids as already added them, they aren't in the isproxy.pod file yet.)
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<p>00:09 <@hezekiah> .
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<p>00:09 <@mids> I didnt
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<p>00:09 <@hezekiah> We should do that before release. :)
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<p>00:10 < lonelynerd> (shouldn't it be --random-dialog and --ignore-empty-random ? ;P)
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<p>00:10 <@hezekiah> lonelynerd: I code what UserX orders. :)
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<p>00:10 < lonelynerd> ok
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<p>00:10 <@hezekiah> nop: So, the seed.rnd problem is solved, but the hhhhhhhh problem isn't.
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<p>00:10 <@nop> right
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<p>00:11 <@nop> hmm, well, we could have a counter that won't allow the same keystroke more than three times in a row
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<p>00:11 <@hezekiah> (I don't even know if hhhhhhhh is a problem. I just mentioned it to you and UserX. You tell me!) :)
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<p>00:11 <@nop> real simple
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<p>00:11 <@nop> it's a slight problem
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<p>00:11 <@hezekiah> PGP some how knows how much entropy text is worth.
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<p>00:11 <@nop> well, we calculate the keyboard timings as well
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<p>00:12 <@nop> we could just force a wait till something beyond 3 same char in a row are pressed
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<p>00:12 <@hezekiah> Does GPG evaluate the entropy of a string of text? If they do, we could look at their code. :)
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<p>00:12 <@nop> I am not sure
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<p>00:12 <@nop> I advise looking at it
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<p>00:12 < lonelynerd> hezekiah, i think it just uses /dev/random, or?
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<p>00:12 <@nop> lonelynerd no
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<p>00:12 <@nop> it doesn't
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<p>00:13 < lonelynerd> ah
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<p>00:13 <@nop> we're talking about creation of entropy
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<p>00:13 <@nop> aside /dev/random
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<p>00:13 <@nop> like an Initialization
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<p>00:13 <@hezekiah> GPG does make the user pound on the keyboard. :)
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<p>00:13 <@mids> well no
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<p>00:13 <@mids> it reads from the entropy pool
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<p>00:13 <@mids> and suggests that you move the mouse + press keys
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<p>00:14 <@mids> but entropy pool can be filled with interrupts etc too
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<p>00:14 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:14 < lonelynerd> yep
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<p>00:14 <@hezekiah> Ah. I just remembered when GPG made me pound on the keyboard once. ;)
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<p>00:14 < lonelynerd> it was pgp perhaps?
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<p>00:14 <@hezekiah> Nope. It was GPG running under Mandrake Linux.
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<p>00:14 < Barney> yep
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<p>00:15 <@hezekiah> (It was a few years ago, before AES was released I remember.) Anyway, back on topic. :)
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<p>00:15 <@nop> I think we should look at the code
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<p>00:15 <@hezekiah> OK. :)
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<p>00:15 < lonelynerd> :)
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<p>00:15 <@nop> if it's not clear, I suggest limiting the characters in a row
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<p>00:15 <@nop> and waiting
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<p>00:15 <@nop> for new characters to be pressed
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<p>00:15 <@hezekiah> Are there any methods outline (maybe in whitepapers from acedemia) on evalutating the entropy worth of a string of text?
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<p>00:16 <@nop> yes there are, I will dig them up in a bit
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<p>00:16 <@hezekiah> Cool! :)
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<p>00:16 < lonelynerd> "ent - A pseudorandom number sequence test program"
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<p>00:16 <@nop> yes, chi squaring
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<p>00:16 <@hezekiah> We could just implement one of those. (Believe it or not, it might be faster than digging through GPG code!) :)
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<p>00:16 <@nop> http://www.gnu.org/software/gnu-crypto/api/gnu/crypto/tool/Ent.html
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<p>00:17 <@nop> that's java
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<p>00:17 <@nop> but still
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<p>00:17 <@hezekiah> I can read Java. :)
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<p>00:17 <@hezekiah> I can translate too. :)
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<p>00:17 < lonelynerd> ent is in C, too
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<p>00:17 <@nop> yep
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<p>00:17 <@hezekiah> lonelynerd: Where can I find the C version?
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<p>00:18 < lonelynerd> apt-get inst.. whoops, ;P http://www.fourmilab.ch/random
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<p>00:18 < lonelynerd> Upstream Author(s): John Walker
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<p>00:21 <@nop> ok
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<p>00:21 <@nop> anyway
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<p>00:21 <@nop> I'm sure that needs to be taken care of b4 1.1
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<p>00:21 <@nop> this will give mids time to update isproxy.pod
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<p>00:21 <@hezekiah> lol
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<p>00:21 <@mids> pff
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<p>00:22 <@mids> say nop, did you work on the docs? :)
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<p>00:22 <@nop> ;)
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<p>00:22 <@nop> I am working on them
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<p>00:22 <@nop> and I have an editor too ;)
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<p>00:22 <@mids> well
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<p>00:22 <@mids> dont edit the html
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<p>00:22 <@nop> I know
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<p>00:22 <@nop> I'm just writing it in notepad
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<p>00:22 <@nop> ;)
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<p>00:22 <@mids> just send me the text changes, yeah thats fine
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<p>00:22 <@hezekiah> Yay! Real HTML coder! Uses a plain text editor! ;-)
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<p>00:23 <@nop> haha
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<p>00:23 <@nop> I ain't coding it
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<p>00:23 <@nop> just typing the doc
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<p>00:23 <@nop> ;)
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<p>00:23 <@mids> so
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<p>00:24 <@mids> will any more features slip in for 1.1?
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<p>00:24 * mids hopes not
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<p>00:24 <@mids> I tried to contact codeshark
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<p>00:24 <@nop> no
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<p>00:24 <@mids> but didnt get a reply yet
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<p>00:24 <@nop> it's not a feature
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<p>00:24 <@nop> it's a bug fix
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<p>00:24 <@nop> ;)
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<p>00:25 <@nop> anyway
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<p>00:25 <@nop> moving forward
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<p>00:25 <@mids> ok, I got other things to do
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<p>00:25 <@mids> if you need me shout loud
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<p>00:25 < lonelynerd> (gpg seems to use get_entropy_count(fd) to check how many bytes /dev/random has to offer)
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<p>00:26 <@nop> right
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<p>00:26 <@nop> aka checking the entropy pool size
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<p>00:26 < lonelynerd> which is some ioctl
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<p>00:26 < lonelynerd> dunno how that would work under windows
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<p>00:26 <@hezekiah> lonelynerd: It probably _doesn't_ work under windows. This a GNU project, remember? :)
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<p>00:27 < lonelynerd> great :)
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<p>00:27 <@hezekiah> What we really want (at least I think we do) is something that can evaluate how much entropy is in a buffer of text.
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<p>00:27 < lonelynerd> but gpg supports also other means to get entropy
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<p>00:27 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:27 <@hezekiah> That way we can have the user keep pounding until we get that much _REAL_ entropy. :)
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<p>00:27 < lonelynerd> hezekiah, ok
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<p>00:27 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:27 <@nop> we should have 1 bits per 3 characters
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<p>00:28 <@nop> technically that's considered secure entropy
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<p>00:28 < lonelynerd> ok, but under linux it could just read /dev/random
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<p>00:28 < lonelynerd> let the windows users type ;)
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<p>00:28 <@hezekiah> Well, isn't "randomentropyneeded" the number of bytes of entropy still needed?
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<p>00:28 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:29 < LeerokOnKnoppix> MD5sum of the registry.
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<p>00:29 <@hezekiah> lonelynerd: UserX, nop, and I have talked about ways to get IIP to use /dev/urandom under controlled circumstances.
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<p>00:29 < lonelynerd> hezekiah, hmm
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<p>00:29 < lonelynerd> hezekiah, urandom is just like random, but it doesn't block when there isn't enough entropy?
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<p>00:31 <@hezekiah> I think so. Is that right, nop?
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<p>00:31 <@nop> yes, with urandom you can assign the amount of entropy in advanced
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<p>00:31 < lonelynerd> so urandom might or might not be secure
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<p>00:32 <@nop> urandom just uses random
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<p>00:32 < lonelynerd> yep
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<p>00:33 <@hezekiah> lonelynerd: That's the issue. :) We considering compiling a list of OS's (and their versions) with secure instances of /dev/urandom, and having IIP use it when it's secure; when it's not secure, IIP would stick with the current methods. It's a thought. :)
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<p>00:33 <@nop> right, but not for 1.1
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<p>00:33 <@nop> ;)
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<p>00:33 <@hezekiah> Of course!
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<p>00:33 < lonelynerd> hezekiah, wouldn't that be "secure versions of random" and not urandom?
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<p>00:33 <@hezekiah> This is all 1.2 stuff I'm talking about. (I am usually always talking 1.2 unless otherwise stated!)
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<p>00:33 < lonelynerd> ok
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<p>00:33 < lonelynerd> sounds great
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<p>00:34 <@nop> lonelynerd nothing wrong with urandom if random is considered secure
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<p>00:34 < lonelynerd> well if you check that there is enough entropy
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<p>00:36 <@hezekiah> So, nop? How exactly do we handle this hhhhhhhh problem?
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<p>00:36 <@nop> well
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<p>00:36 <@nop> for 1.1.0 I would limit the amount of repeated characters
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<p>00:36 <@nop> in a row that is
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<p>00:36 <@nop> and then leave it for in depth discussion in 1.2
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<p>00:37 <@hezekiah> OK. But what happens when someone does pattern like "hHhHhHhHhHhHhH"?
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<p>00:37 < lonelynerd> :)
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<p>00:37 <@nop> we need to create a counter that spaces it out
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<p>00:37 <@hezekiah> (Let's assume the user is an idiot. The software is only as secure as the user!) :)
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<p>00:37 <@nop> so so many bytes can not contain this letter
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<p>00:37 <@nop> since last used
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<p>00:37 < jeremiah> hello
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<p>00:37 <@nop> hi
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<p>00:37 <@hezekiah> jeremiah: hi. :)
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<p>00:37 < jeremiah> hey hezekiah
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<p>00:38 <@nop> for instance [h][H][xonH[xonH[ etc
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<p>00:38 <@hezekiah> So, 'h' can't be repeated more than _m_ times in _x_ bytes?
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<p>00:38 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:38 < jeremiah> are we talking about buffer overflows?
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<p>00:38 <@nop> it will be considered rejected entropy
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<p>00:38 <@hezekiah> jeremiah: Nope! We're talking about entropy! :)
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<p>00:38 <@nop> but still log the keyboard timings
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<p>00:38 <@nop> just ignore it as a string
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<p>00:39 < jeremiah> random number generators are supposed to make sure there isn't a correlation with the numbers anyways
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<p>00:39 < jeremiah> you can do that with chi-square
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<p>00:39 < jeremiah> right?
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<p>00:40 <@nop> well yarrow helps mix
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<p>00:41 <@hezekiah> You said we "log the keyboard timings". What's that mean?
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<p>00:42 < jeremiah> hezekiah: times between when you hit keys
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<p>00:42 < lonelynerd> that's difficult if input is buffered
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<p>00:42 <@nop> just do the character thing, it will be fine
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<p>00:42 <@nop> yarrow does the rest
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<p>00:42 <@hezekiah> nop: Are we getting the entropy from the keys being hit or the timing between when the keys get hit?
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<p>00:42 <@nop> both
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<p>00:42 <@hezekiah> Oh. OK. :)
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<p>00:42 <@hezekiah> I'll just write up some code that prohibits 'char' repeating more than 'm' times in 'x' bytes. :)
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<p>00:43 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:43 <@nop> thnx
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<p>00:43 <@hezekiah> Then for development, we brainstorm. ;-)
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<p>00:43 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:44 < LeerokOnKnoppix> How 'bout you get entropy from all possible inputs like the microphone, internet, processor speed, temperature, memory usage and speed, and other things?
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<p>00:44 < lonelynerd> LeerokOnKnoppix, calm down :P
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<p>00:44 <@hezekiah> I refuse to collect entropy from my internet connection; if someone can sniff it, then the quality of my entropy is lowwered.
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<p>00:45 <@nop> haha
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<p>00:45 < lonelynerd> yeah, and the kernel already does a nice job in gathering entropy. applications shouldn't do it
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<p>00:46 <@hezekiah> lonelynerd: That works fine as long as IIP is run on an OS with good kernel random number support. There are OS's that exist that _don't_ have good support!
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<p>00:46 < PsionX> like windows
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<p>00:46 <@hezekiah> lol
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<p>00:46 < lonelynerd> hezekiah, yep
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<p>00:46 -!- PsionX is now known as WindowsHater
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<p>00:46 < WindowsHater> lol
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<p>00:46 < lonelynerd> hezekiah, just use some #ifdef there
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<p>00:47 -!- WindowsHater is now known as PsionX
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<p>00:47 <@nop> this was discussed earlier
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<p>00:47 <@nop> and we will look at it on 1.2
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<p>00:47 <@nop> moving on
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<p>00:47 < lonelynerd> ok ok
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<p>00:47 <@nop> we'll end up repeating ourselves
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<p>00:47 <@nop> a dozen times
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<p>00:47 <@nop> before this meeting is over
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<p>00:47 <@hezekiah> Yeah. :)
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<p>00:47 <@hezekiah> Next item! :)
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<p>00:49 <@hezekiah> Uh, nop? Do we have a next item?
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<p>00:49 <@hezekiah> Perhaps: "What's on the list until we can release IIP 1.1"
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<p>00:50 <@hezekiah> Currently, I have:
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<p>00:50 <@hezekiah> 1.) mids adds docs for --randomdialog and --ignoreemptyrandom to isproxy.pod
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<p>00:50 <@hezekiah> 2.) nop finishes working on his HTML docs
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<p>00:50 <@nop> yeah
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<p>00:50 <@hezekiah> 3.) We correct the 'hhhhhhhh' entropy problem by prohibiting a certain number of repeated characters.
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<p>00:51 <@hezekiah> Anything else?
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<p>00:51 <@nop> right
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<p>00:51 <@nop> nope
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<p>00:51 <@nop> not that i know of
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<p>00:51 <@hezekiah> Well, hopefully all that will be done by next week! :)
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<p>00:51 <@hezekiah> (Or earlier!)
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<p>00:51 <@nop> yes
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<p>00:54 <@hezekiah> So what's next on the agenda?
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<p>00:55 <@nop> umm
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<p>00:55 <@nop> questions,
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<p>00:55 <@hezekiah> lol!
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<p>00:55 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Not much, it appears.
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<p>00:55 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Will there be socks?
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<p>00:55 * PsionX looks at his feet
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<p>00:55 < LeerokOnKnoppix> No, I mean the proxy thing.
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<p>00:55 <@nop> not in 1.1.0
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<p>00:56 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Hmm.
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<p>00:57 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Will there be IP spoofing?
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<p>00:57 < lonelynerd> w-what?
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<p>00:57 <@nop> umm, not in this lifetime
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<p>00:57 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Never mind.
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<p>00:57 < LeerokOnKnoppix> I'm just thinking up random questions.
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<p>00:58 < lonelynerd> :)
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<p>00:58 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Will there be any sort of file-transer?
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<p>00:58 < LeerokOnKnoppix> *transfer
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<p>00:58 <@nop> not in 1.1
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<p>00:58 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Will there be buddy icons?
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<p>00:58 <@hezekiah> LOL
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<p>00:59 < PsionX> will someone please shut him up?
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<p>00:59 < lonelynerd> LeerokOnKnoppix, you can already transfer files over iip but it's a bit slow
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<p>00:59 < LeerokOnKnoppix> I know.
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<p>01:01 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Will there be Reversi?
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<p>01:01 < PsionX> this guy wants everything and a bag of chips too
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<p>01:02 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Indeed.
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<p>01:02 <@nop> the best question
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<p>01:02 <@nop> will the human race be freed
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<p>01:02 <@nop> from oppression
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<p>01:02 < LeerokOnKnoppix> With IIP? Certainly!
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<p>01:02 <@hezekiah> lol!
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<p>01:02 < PsionX> i got a question
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<p>01:02 < PsionX> ... can i kick hezy in the butt for no good reson?
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<p>01:02 <@nop> sure
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<p>01:02 < PsionX> lol
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<p>01:03 <@hezekiah> nop: So my work for now is to write up the repeating-character-entropy fix.
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<p>01:03 <@nop> yes
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<p>01:03 <@nop> oh and change the world in one sitting
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<p>01:04 <@hezekiah> lol
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<p>01:04 * aum pulls his face out of the other windows
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<p>01:04 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Peace in Iraq.
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<p>01:04 < aum> hi all
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<p>01:04 < LeerokOnKnoppix> Hello.
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<p>01:04 <@hezekiah> Oh, boy! I spent TOO LONG going over THAT one!
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<p>01:04 <@nop> hi aum
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<p>01:04 < PsionX> ...
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<p>01:04 < PsionX> ... i got spikeys
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<p>01:05 <@hezekiah> Question!
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<p>01:05 < PsionX> Answer
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<p>01:06 <@hezekiah> After IIP 1.1 is released, are we going to sit down and draw up a nice linear list of what needs to be done to decentralize the ircd server? (For example: does the "core" code need to be completed first?)
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<p>01:09 <@nop> yes we will do that
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<p>01:09 <@mids> s/1.1/1.1.0/
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<p>01:09 <@hezekiah> lol. OK, mids. :)
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<p>01:10 <@hezekiah> mids: Though it should probably be s/1\.1/1.1.0/ just for clarity's sake. ;-)
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<p>01:10 <@mids> oops, sorry
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<p>01:10 <@hezekiah> lol. :)
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<p>01:11 <@hezekiah> Also:
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<p>01:11 <@mids> maybe before decentralizing there should be another step
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<p>01:11 <@hezekiah> I've seen that there is the capability to make varios crypto cores.
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<p>01:11 <@mids> keeping a central irc, but letting the proxy be IRC aware
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<p>01:11 <@mids> so it can already handle private conversations
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<p>01:11 <@mids> etc
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<p>01:14 <@hezekiah> mids: i.e. it interprets /msg and does direct user-to-user encryption?
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<p>01:14 <@mids> yes
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<p>01:14 <@hezekiah> Well, I don't know how abstract things have to say, but I think it's a good idea until we can get the server decentralized! :)
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<p>01:16 <@hezekiah> About the crypto cores: if IIP has several crypto cores (SOCKS, SSL, and custom for example), then what happens when you have a connection between a user and several relays that has different encryption between each link?
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<p>01:16 <@mids> you can do what GPG does
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<p>01:16 <@mids> require a minimum
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<p>01:16 <@mids> and if both parties have better, use that
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<p>01:16 <@mids> also look hope SILC does it
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<p>01:17 <@mids> bye hezekiah
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<p>01:17 < PsionX> LOL dial up
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<p>01:17 < PsionX> lol on hezy
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<p>01:17 <@mids> ;)
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<p>01:17 <@mids> wb
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<p>01:17 < hezekiah> Let's say that SOCKS is weaker than SSL (I have no idea if it is.)
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<p>01:18 < namless> what about own privat/publick keys that the user can add to (client or to IIP proxy) so he can crypt what he talks to chertain chanels or private querys? (meaning users who downt have the right key on these special chanels or private queries down understant other users and IIP proxy filters this crypted text away)
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<p>01:18 < hezekiah> (Sorry about being nocked off the internet folks; my brother probably tried to get on.)
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<p>01:18 < namless> down -> dont (dam bad english and typos :(
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<p>01:19 <@mids> namless: like the existing blowfish etc encryption for irc clients, but then server side
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<p>01:19 <@mids> (psybnc has it too)
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<p>01:19 < namless> jep
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<p>01:20 < namless> the system vould be build into the IIP proxy so it could be transparent to the client...
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<p>01:20 <@mids> another thing that I'd like to see is support for multiple layers on the same 'mixnet'
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<p>01:20 < namless> vould-> could
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<p>01:20 <@mids> so you can do multiple protocols with the same relays
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<p>01:22 < hezekiah> (OK. This is getting annoying.)
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<p>01:22 <@mids> probably it is bedtime for you :)
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<p>01:23 < hezekiah> Nah. That's not for hours.
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<p>01:23 <@mids> so no divine intervention?
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<p>01:23 < hezekiah> lol
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<p>01:23 < hezekiah> So, mids. From what the logs said (Thank God for logs), you mentioned that we could do as GPG does: require a minimum and use better if we have it.
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<p>01:24 <@mids> yeah
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<p>01:24 <@mids> probably different systems can be compatible too
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<p>01:24 <@mids> like homebrew DH and SSL one
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<p>01:24 <@mids> with SSL just beeing faster
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<p>01:24 < hezekiah> But all the advantage of one connection type being securer than the other are lost when someone along the long uses something less secure.
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<p>01:24 -!- LeerokOnKnoppix is now known as LeerokShovelSno
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<p>01:26 < hezekiah> Oops. s/along the long/along the line/
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<p>01:26 < hezekiah> Well, we can worry about that another day.
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<p>01:26 <@mids> k
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<p>01:26 <@mids> btw, any idea how to do something like <br> in POD format?
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<p>01:26 < hezekiah> nop: Sometime we should also work on implementing RKA. :)
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<p>01:27 < hezekiah> mids: You know more about POD than I do because I know nothing about POD! :)
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<p>01:29 <@nop> well we have RKA working but not as good as we'd like
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<p>01:29 <@nop> the GMP stuff will change that
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<p>01:29 < hezekiah> mids: "E<escape>" -- a character escape
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<p>01:29 < hezekiah> nop: We do? When did that happen?
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<p>01:29 <@nop> it's been in
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<p>01:30 <@nop> every 52 blocks it changes keys
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<p>01:30 < hezekiah> Ah
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<p>01:30 < hezekiah> Do you think we might make the key changing a little more random?
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<p>01:30 < namless> "everyting should be random"...
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<p>01:31 < hezekiah> Like having a random number checked every 10 blocks and a 1 out of 3 chance of the key changing?
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<p>01:31 < hezekiah> ... or having an SHA sum of the last 3 plaintext messages checked and a 1 out of 3 chance of the key changing based on that?
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<p>01:35 < lonelynerd> hmm
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<p>01:35 <@mids> ok, info about --randomdialog and --ignoreemptyrandom added to POD
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<p>01:35 < namless> by the way how "similar" is the traffic IIP is making? is there any plans to make this traffic to look as much random it can be? if the "transfer macanism" makes a static mark in the traffic then it can be detected as IIP traffic and can be started to be monitored and well there only the sky is the limit...
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<p>01:35 < hezekiah> And committed to HEAD and development?
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<p>01:36 <@mids> oops
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<p>01:36 * mids does to dev too
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<p>01:37 < hezekiah> nop? Are you there?
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<p>01:37 <@nop> sorry
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<p>01:37 <@nop> what
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<p>01:37 <@nop> dude, my brain is gone
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<p>01:37 <@nop> can we discuss all this later
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<p>01:37 < hezekiah> OK. :)
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<p>01:37 < hezekiah> Sorry. :)
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<p>01:38 <@mids> ok, lets close
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<p>01:38 < hezekiah> (If it makes you feel any better, my brain is going to be gone too after a Physics review and some calcus!) :)
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<p>01:38 <@mids> commited to development too
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<p>01:38 * hezekiah hands mids the "baff"er
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<p>01:38 < hezekiah> OK. Good! :0
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<p>01:38 <@mids> *baff*
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<p>01:38 < hezekiah> s/0$/)/
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<p>01:38 < hezekiah> Bye all! :)
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<p>01:38 <@mids> cya next week
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<p>01:40 < lonelynerd> bye
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<p>--- Log closed Wed Feb 19 01:40:48 2003
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</div>
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{% endblock %}
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